Difference between revisions of "Talk:Main Page"

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==Item Shop Inventories==
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==Important message, outages, announcements, etc==
 +
If the mud is down or you need to announce some big thing happening or there's a bug that does something super bad or similar please:
 +
#Go copy a message you like from [{{SERVER}}/w/index.php?title=Sitenotice&action=edit Editing Sitenotice]
 +
#Go to [[MediaWiki:Sitenotice]] and paste and edit the message for this specific use. Save.
 +
#Go to [[MediaWiki:Sitenotice id]] and increase the number by 1. Save.
 +
This can only be done by users with the <code>editinterface</code> permission. [{{SERVER}}/w/index.php?title=Special:ListUsers&group=sysop These users] have access.
  
I have noticed that there is not a comprehensive list of item shops (as far as I can find) and this could be a useful thing to put on the Wiki.  This would help people find particular items which they want or need and is also a large but relatively easy project for me to research since I'm kind of a newbie.  Can someone with some experience in adding to the Wiki tell me if this is a good idea?
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After the notice has served its use:
--[[User:Thistleryver|Thistleryver]] 04:54, 14 April 2011 (UTC)
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#Go to [[MediaWiki:Sitenotice]] and clear everything so it doesn't leave a ghost dismiss link.
 +
#(Optional) Copy your super cool new message that might be reused in [{{SERVER}}/w/index.php?title=Sitenotice&action=edit Editing Sitenotice].
  
:While it is something that would be worthwhile, especially if items are browse appraised (unfortunately you have to do it one item at a time), but since but Kefka has already made a fine database [http://daftjunk.com/dw/items/ here] I guess I don't feel an urgency to redo it all. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 05:18, 14 April 2011 (UTC)
 
  
==Judge==
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If you cannot modify that page, then [{{SERVER}}/w/index.php?title=Sitenotice&action=edit edit Sitenotice] with the message you would like to be displayer on all wiki pages.
 +
*This is not currently going to update the banner. This will have to be done manually. But it should be noticed and someone will (probably) modify [[MediaWiki:Sitenotice]] or offer feedback.
 +
<!-- Doesn't quite work, takes super long, not sure what's going on.
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*This is a little buggy at this time, so someone might have to copy it to [[MediaWiki:Sitenotice]] for it to work. Research to improve this is ongoing.
 +
*Then visit [{{SERVER}}/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Sitenotice&action=purge this page] or [{{SERVER}}/wiki/MediaWiki:Sitenotice?action=purge this one], if you see <code>OK</code> below <code>Clear the cache of this page?</code> the click OK to update the transclusion of the [[MediaWiki:Sitenotice]] that holds the real message. You probably have to be logged in to purge. This might take several minutes to update.
 +
-->
  
As of [http://discworld.atuin.net/lpc/blog/blog.c?action=filter&blog=recent%20developments&id=357 this announcement], judge now works in a completely different way.  This means that:
 
* All of the existing weapons rating data is invalid.
 
* We can't use the judge-method to determine a weapon's rating either.
 
  
There will be a short period of silence, followed by a long period of swearing, followed by changes to several templates.  Please bear with me. --[[User:Chat|Chat]] 19:08, 10 January 2011 (UTC)
+
See also the [[Status]] page for a place to discuss issues.
  
:OK, I now think we've got enough research on Judge to start putting weapon ratings back in.  A word of caution, however: Please don't add any weapon ratings in unless you:
+
--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] ([[User talk:Frazyl|talk]]) 12:50, 20 September 2020 (EDT)
:#Have read [[Research:Judge]]
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:#Have a JIR of at least 220 in the appropriate weapon class (If you don't know what a JIR is, go back to step 1).
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:Or your information won't be accurate.
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:--[[User:Chat|Chat]] 19:46, 19 January 2011 (UTC)
+
  
 +
== Alternative login: disctemp.starturtle.net port 23 or 4242 ==
  
Shortly I'll update the weapon infobox for entering judge data for overall, attack and parry with strength between 8 and 24. Provided it doesn't go horribly wrong and need to be reverted for fixes.
+
Note for 18 Sep 2020 by QingFeng: The usual path to the MUD discworld.starturtle.net port 4242 is down! There is an alternative path to the mud: disctemp.starturtle.net port 23 or 4242. This is not a temporary copy of the MUD, it is another path to the actual MUD.
  
It should be easy to extend it beyond 24 if need be, just some copy paste but I'm not sure anyone is testing beyond that.
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(One) Wodan wisps: and this is NOT a temp mud, but the real thing, in case anyone wasn't clear on that yet
  
As a side-effect, the old judge overall, attack and parry data will not show anymore. This is necessary because without str we don't know what the old data was and it needs to be rechecked or entered. This is consistent with similar past updates.
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==Adding users to the wiki==
 +
Administrators for this wiki can create new accounts if anyone playing on the mud wants one. The only criteria right now is that they must have an account on Discworld mud. The account name should match one of their mud account name or be a recognizable variation of it. Accounts of past players are kept to know who modified what even if they are deleted from the mud.
  
The prototype for the new infobox filled with new data will be in [[Fine sabre]].
+
Players should contact through the mud someone from [{{fullurl:Special:ListUsers|group=sysop}} this list] who has been active on the mud recently asking for an account to be made for them.
  
Unfortunately, it's not possible to just copy the data from the tables because it reads the string, not the number...  
+
The procedure for wiki administrators is:
It's possible it can be made to work with numbers with more work.
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#Go to [[Special:CreateAccount]], when logged in.
 +
#With email
 +
##Enter a username and an email address, and click the "by email" button.
 +
##The account will be created with a random password which is then emailed to the given address (as with the "forgot password" feature). The user will be requested to change password at first login; when they do, their e-mail address will also be marked as confirmed.
 +
#Without email
 +
##Without an email the administrator enters the requested password or makes a random one.
 +
##They then send the password to the user by mudmail telling them to login and change their password to something else.
 +
#If anything fails, post a message to [[User_talk:Frazyl]] or send a mudmail to Frazyl.
  
--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 01:13, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
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--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] ([[User talk:Frazyl|talk]]) 02:08, 23 December 2016 (EST)
  
Ok it works now as in [[Fine sabre]]. I'd just like to put table lines for the str table but it doesn't want to work.
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==Clubs pages==
 +
Also asked by Emily for other mudders is to have pages for clubs. This is fine, you can create pages for your club as a subpage like [[Club/Charm Chasers]].
  
For those weapons done by Baldarov and others with the "Strength/Judge Results table" the info in that table was the one to use anyway, not the data without str in the infobox that's not shown anymore.
+
The club pages will be listed automagically in the [[Club]] page.
  
Todo: see if I can muck up something so we can put the numbers 1 to 14 instead of the label like "rather good" to place the info in the infobox for all those pages. Another day though. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 03:16, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
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--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] ([[User talk:Frazyl|talk]]) 16:39, 9 November 2018 (EST)
  
:I like the idea to summarize everything to one side of the weapon page. However, an opinion - aesthetically, the fine sabre example looks, well, overly busy on the weapon info column now.  Would it be possible to do a multiinfobox?  The front box could be as it has been, but have the Str-16 (being median 9 to 23) relevant judge info displayed.  Then, if a person so desires, the second info box could just show the expanded judge info. If preferred, I can move this thought to the template's discussion area. --[[User:Groth|Groth]] 03:35, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
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==Todo==
 +
*Update to latest MediaWiki.
 +
*Move quests to individual pages in quests namespace (to prevent showing up in default search) with warning at the beginning and include them all in existing pages. This makes it easier to read the whole quest if you want to or to edit it, it still shows the pages with hidden text like now for those who prefer that, and it allows linking quests in several lists.
 +
*Think of a way to allow people to create accounts themselves by checking that they have accounts on the mud, copy/pasting something from the mud or something like that.
 +
*Document everything on the mud. {{Research}}
 +
--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] ([[User talk:Frazyl|talk]]) 02:08, 23 December 2016 (EST)
  
::That's an interesting idea. But looking over all the str variations would take 14 clicks and wouldn't the buttons to show all available str be rather similarly spammy? Then again I'm not very knowledgeable on the multipane infobox things, maybe it can be made to work...
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== TM wiki gone ==
  
::Would it help if the other judge info were put on top? --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 03:59, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
+
As Aphaea noticed, the [http://tmwiki.firstserved.net/ TM wiki] is gone, but archive.org still has several snapshots, [http://web.archive.org/web/20120818122620/http://tmwiki.firstserved.net/index.php/The_TM_Project this is the latest one]. Aphaea has started copying data across, I was just wondering: Would it be better to have the TM stuff on the skills' research pages? --[[User:Gunde|Gunde]] 16:05, 28 March 2013 (UTC)
  
::Oh maybe if instead of rather good (11/14) it was just "11 rather good" that would save 1/3 lines. Or I could scrap the string name to save on vertical space... --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 04:04, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
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I think it's fine either way. I'd prefer if all the bonus ranges were on the same page because it means less clicking. The way Aphaea is doing seems fine to me, especially since there's links to other skills to help navigation. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 17:42, 28 March 2013 (UTC)
  
::Ok changed it. It looks much more compact now. Still wish there were lines between rows. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 04:36, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
 
  
:::Regarding the click for your str part there could be links to click for each str there is data for and one to show all. I just have no idea how to make that work with css at the moment. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 07:10, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
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Working on creating a house format for the TMs section being added to all the skills pages.
  
I made the infobox accept numbers instead of string so you can put "11" instead of "very-good" as a first step to be able to enter the data from table in the infobox. I also tried to make a template {{tl|Judge-str}} to make entering data take less typing but it doesn't work yet. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 20:03, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
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So far removing all anomalies at the start of fields and capitalzing them however I will be aiming to have the 'action taken' field in a set format rather than it is now, before i work out how this will be i would like peoples input (If this page is still used --[[User:Ascdren|Ascdren]] 13:27 30 march 2013 (UTC)
 
+
:Ok it works now, you just need to type for example <pre>{{subst:Judge-str|9|10|10|11}}</pre> It then substitutes this when you save the page so that it looks like you didn't use it but it was used when converting [[Rose-hilted long sword]]. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 05:52, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
+
 
+
 
+
 
+
It wasn't easy, but the dynamically updated table for weapons is done for [[Daggers]].
+
 
+
Basically for every weapon page we need to change
+
<pre>
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{{Infobox weapon
+
...
+
}}
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</pre>
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and replace it with
+
<pre>
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<onlyinclude>{{Weapon_data
+
...
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}}</onlyinclude>
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</pre>
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The data inside the template also needs to be updated to have the str versions like: Judge-overall-13 = pretty good
+
 
+
Numeric values also work like: Judge-overall-13 = 9
+
 
+
For now I put the values for 13 str in the table because there's no space for all possible str. Not sure if or how to make the str shown change.
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+
 
+
On another topic, is there still what we can call "excellent xxx" weapons? Is someone going to update those pages with what, max overall value or do we scrap the pages?
+
 
+
--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 03:55, 30 May 2011 (UTC)
+
 
+
 
+
I synchronized the weights from the old table for daggers, some of those were more up to date than the pages for the weapons. Those checked with a balance should be bold as before. I weighted the delicate black stiletto, it wasn't the same weight for both. The new table is up and running, there's still a bunch of daggers with tables to move to the weapon_data. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 08:28, 30 May 2011 (UTC)
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+
 
+
For weapons using multiinfobox it is not possible to just include multiple boxes at once with current code. The solution is to create one sub page and place just the weapon_infobox inside them and then include those in the multiinfobox like in [[Switchblade]]. You then load the sub pages in the weapons table but not the main page and they'll all show up! :) --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 21:31, 30 May 2011 (UTC)
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==Spam==
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We seem to have a new breed of spammers (you can recognize them by their usernames, which comprise of a name followed by a random sequence of numbers) that are able to defeat the captcha to create accounts and then insert spam URLs into pages.  Because they're using logged-in accounts, we can't use semi-protection to defend against them
+
 
+
There are, however, a few things we can do:
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* At the moment, all user accounts are immediately promoted to auto-confirmed user accounts - what this means is that they're immediately able to edit semi-protected pages.  We could change the default settings for auto-confirmation (would require Drakkos to do, but should be trivial) such that user accounts must make a minimum number of edits and exist for a minimum number of days before they are autoconfirmed - this is what most other wikis do, and would put spammers back at the mercy of our protection-settings.
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* Of interesting note is that all the pages targetted by this type of spammer have 'armour' somewhere in their title (presumably to create some sort of association with 'health shield' or some such).  If they start getting annoying, we could just full-protect pages with 'armour' in the title for a while.  Obviously, this has the downside of stopping anyone else from editing them too, however.
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* I'm not sure whether there are known vulnerabilities with reCaptcha that have been patched in a more recent version; if so then perhaps a simple upgrade will resolve matters.
+
 
+
--[[User:Chat|Chat]] 00:11, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
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+
:Changing auto confirmed settings would be the best option I reckon. [[User:Rehevkor|Rehevkor]] <big>[[User talk:Rehevkor|<FONT COLOR="black">✉</FONT>]]</big> 14:59, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
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+
::I agree.  Though I wouldn't be opposed to temporarily full-protecting those pages if it kicks up again (seems to have stopped now, so maybe it was a one-off thing, knock wood), since they're not exactly busy pages.  --[[User:Ilde|Ilde]] 19:00, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
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+
:::I just had to revert the armour page again :( [[User:Zexium|Zexium]] 04:03, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
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::::and now the category:armour page .... I've tried something that assumes the script will abort if it finds an apparently already spammed page ... there's an html comment containing what looks like the spamlink as a wikilink - fingers crossed [[User:Zexium|Zexium]] 05:10, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
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:::::Based on how spambots have behaved in the past, I really really doubt they check the page first before spamlinking - it's just not worth their time/coding effort to do so over the blunt-force approach.  There've been several pages where spambots merrily competed with themselves to rewrite links in the past, before someone got around to protecting them.  In any case, I don't like the idea of putting their links into comments, as:
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:::::*It feels too much like doing their job for them, and would achieve their goal if someone naive/stupid started editing an article and felt like following the strange, commented out link.
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:::::*Let's say it worked, and the spambot had a script that realized the page was already spammed.  I think it's possible the spambot would then have logic that says 'Aha, some of my spam still exists here!  Here's a wiki that's not closely monitored, where spam/vandalism aren't cleaned up very often.  Focus spam effort on this wiki!'
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:::::*Note that the spam links appear to have some kind of revision ID in them.  I assume that's going to get changed after a while (to make naive string-matching based anti-spam systems fail to spot it), at which point all the commented out links will be useless.
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:::::I'm removing the commented out link for now.  If we get much more spam, I'll try locking down the armour pages for a while. --[[User:Chat|Chat]] 10:54, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
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Another idea if the update of reCaptcha doesn't stop spammers and they make it through the time limit and number of edits would be to make accounts not auto-confirm themselves automatically.
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Instead, having admin users approve new users manually either on request or regularly (by checking if there's a discworld user by that name?) would probably frustrate spammers enough that they move on elsewhere.
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I'm not sure which is least annoying to actual new users, to have to go through a testing period or ask someone through the mud. For catching spammers it would be spotting bad small edits vs approving new users regularly.
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+
--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 20:02, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
+
  
 
==Archiving==
 
==Archiving==
The main talk page was getting pretty big, so I've archived the old bits off.
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To archive the {{PAGENAME}}:
 
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*Create a new archive page called 'Talk:{{PAGENAME}}''/Archive X', where X is the number after the last archive page listed on top of this page.
The process for doing this is:
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*Move any sections which have been solved or that are old and not useful anymore to this new page.  
*Archive talk pages when you start seeing the "'''WARNING: This page is X kilobytes long'''; some browsers may have problems editing pages approaching or longer than 32kb. Please consider breaking the page into smaller sections." message when editing them.
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*Put the {{tl|talkarchive}} template at the top of the archive page.
*Move any sections which have not had edits within the last 30 days to the archive page.
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*Update the {{tl|archives}} template (increase numarchives by one) at the top of this page.
*The archive page is called 'Talk:''pagename''/Archive X', where X is 1, 2, 3, etc.
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--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] ([[User talk:Frazyl|talk]]) 02:08, 23 December 2016 (EST)
*Put the {{tl|talkarchive}} template at the top of each archive page.
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*Put (or update) the {{tl|archives}} template at the top of the main talk page.
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--[[User:Chat|Chat]] 17:25, 16 September 2009 (UTC)
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+
==Viewing figures==
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+
Just thought you guys might like to know - unique daily visits to the site for the month of December 2009 broke 1,000 - we hit 1,001, as a matter of fact. 
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For interest, here are the figures for the past few months:
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<pre>
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+
Mar 2010        1104
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Feb 2010        1212
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Jan 2010        1114
+
Dec 2009 1001
+
Nov 2009 919
+
Oct 2009 796
+
Sep 2009 676
+
Aug 2009 540
+
Jul 2009 398
+
Jun 2009 279
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May 2009 165
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</pre>
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Great work everyone - many thanks for your continued work in making this wiki a great resource for DW players everywhere!  [[User:Drakkos|Drakkos]] 21:54, 3 January 2010 (UTC)
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:January 2010 hit 1114 unique daily visits, FWIW.  [[User:Drakkos|Drakkos]] 00:21, 2 February 2010 (UTC)
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:February 2010 : 1212
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::Interesting. Increasing fairly consistently. [[User:Rehevkor|Rehevkor]] <big>[[User talk:Rehevkor|<FONT COLOR="black">✉</FONT>]]</big> 13:31, 2 March 2010 (UTC)
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== Quest pages ==
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What's the plan for the quest pages to remain in sync? That is, quests are duplicated on several pages, odds are modifications on one page won't be made on all of them unless everyone is aware that the quest is also present on another page.
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I thought that maybe there was a wiki thing in place so that sections from one page came from another or that they mirrored each other but apparently not. Not sure if that's something that actually exists. Anyone know?
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+
Barring that, should we remove duplicate quests and replace some of them with links? Or some other way to keep all the quest text in sync?
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+
I came up with some ways to handle the issue:
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*Make a page for every quest, the other pages link to the quest page. Downside is there will be lots of pages.
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*Put all quests on one page, then the other pages link to the section of the quest. Probably a bad idea because the page would be too big.
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*Make sure each quest is only on one page and that other pages are only links. Would need to decide on a level (domain/area/city) which would hold the real quest text.
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*Add comments in the source of duplicated quests that the other version needs to be updated as well. People could miss that though.
+
*Insert idea here.
+
 
+
Or does everyone feel quests duplicated on several pages is no big deal after all? [[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 22:31, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
+
 
+
:The third one would be easiest, but... eh.  The first one is probably the best solution (possibly we could even stop using hidden text), but I don't like that they would then show up in [[Special:Random]].  They do currently, but it's not especially important because 1)there are comparatively few of them, and 2)spoilers are hidden and mostly below the fold anyway.  There are only 1,234 content pages currently, so if we added a few hundred quest pages they'd be a significant portion of that.  Maybe if we had a separate namespace ([http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Using_custom_namespaces]) for them?  Then they wouldn't show up randomly. --[[User:Ilde|Ilde]] 02:23, 15 March 2010 (UTC)
+
 
+
::A separate namespace sounds good especially if it allows us to show the text unhidden. As it turns out Special:Random also excludes redirects, so we could add redirects from the normal namespace for pages people might search or we want to link to... Probably only entry pages with warnings like Category:Quest pages and Unofficial_Quest_Solutions. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 02:53, 15 March 2010 (UTC)
+
 
+
::: I actually like the hidden text as it enables me to uncover the mystery line by line if required (for example if I get stuck just because I cannot figure out the right verb, "exacto" comes to mind...). --[[User:Gunde|Gunde]] 23:19, 31 March 2010 (UTC)
+
 
+
So, will someone create a quest namespace for quest articles? Or should we put them in the research namespace?
+
 
+
The primary advantage of a quest namespace is that this will stop quest pages appearing in [[Special:Random]], which can send someone who doesn't want to be spoiled to a quest page and it will stop them appearing in default search (happens when the article doesn't exist) [[Special:Search]], which will reveal the context of the search, that is unhidden quest info.
+
 
+
--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 18:31, 7 May 2010 (UTC)
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:AFAIK, creating a new namespace requires editing the server's LocalSettings.php; as such it's something that only [[User talk:Drakkos|Drakkos]] can do, so you should speak to him.
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+
:Please don't move quests into the Research: namespace - that will end up polluting Research: with things that aren't research, and we don't want that.
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:--[[User:Chat|Chat]] 22:45, 7 May 2010 (UTC)
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+
::Hey, what about the Help: namespace?  It is somewhat appropriate and not really in use (the only thing in it is [[Help:Contents]]), and I don't think Special:Random catches pages in it.
+
::--[[User:Ilde|Ilde]] 18:42, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
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+
Ok, so I came up with a few ideas to improve quest pages. For the namespace I was waiting for the captcha to be installed first so as not to ask too much at once...
+
 
+
So I made a template {{tl|Prehidden}} that basically is like {{tl|prebox}} with white on white text. The advantage of prebox is that it preserves line breaks and spaces and other characters without breaking out too easily as with &lt;p> (making a list with * or : makes everything after visible) while removing then obsolete &lt;br> tags and allowing some formatting like '''bold''' or ''italic''. Also it puts a pretty box around the text.
+
:See [[Alchemists'_Guild_quests]] for examples.
+
If it is agreeable we could turn {{tl|Hidden}} like {{tl|Prehidden}} unless there something that I didn't think of.
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As for quest duplication, it is possible to include pages with {{tl|Include}}. It's only a matter of merging quests into the subpage and the template includes them with formatting and a link to the included page.
+
:As for what includes what [[Unofficial_quest_solutions]] looks good, there's some difference to the structure of the Discworld quest pages though.
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If we get a namespace for quests, I was thinking that each quest could get its own page in non-hidden text, which would then be included in the lists in {{tl|Prehidden}} boxes. So if you don't want to be spoiled too much you can check the lists and to edit the quest and to be spoiled it would be easier to see it all at once in the quest page. It would use a tweaked include template.
+
 
+
--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 07:02, 11 June 2010 (UTC)
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:Ooooo!  The include templates are a neat solution for the duplication issue; kudos for that. --[[User:Ilde|Ilde]] 03:04, 12 June 2010 (UTC)
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+
Slight issue, when including a page with the template include it doesn't work. You'd think it would check if there really was a loop, but no it just refuses to do anything. The only workaround that comes to mind is to make duplicate {{tl|Include}} templates, one per level. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 07:14, 11 June 2010 (UTC)
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+
 
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Ok all pages have the same format and duplicate quests have all been merged except for Sentimentalist and Distant Exhibitionist which have several versions.
+
 
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Some quests fitted several areas, put them in the most important area. To place a quest in several areas would mean putting the quests in individual quest pages and including those in all list pages that is concerned, but we said that would be too many pages so we'd need the quest namespace. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 02:01, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
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+
 
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It occurred to me that while we can't include the text of the quests that could go in several places in more than one place (because we can't include sections, only pages as far as I know with mediawiki) we could place links to the quest.
+
 
+
Might be worth going through the quests vs the mud quest pages to put stubs for quests missing and links to quests that are somewhere else, at some point.
+
 
+
--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 23:20, 13 July 2010 (UTC)
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+
== Articles that are categories ==
+
 
+
I've noticed a few of these. Categories that are masquerading as articles. One example being [[:Category:Dibbler_clones]] - all the information there should be in an article. I've noticed several of these scattered about. Would be there be any opposition to cleaning this up? [[User:Rehevkor|Rehevkor]] <big>[[User talk:Rehevkor|<FONT COLOR="black">✉</FONT>]]</big> 23:21, 18 December 2010 (UTC)
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:And also, bred and butter information such as this should not be in categories as they will not show on default searches. [[User:Rehevkor|Rehevkor]] <big>[[User talk:Rehevkor|<FONT COLOR="black">✉</FONT>]]</big> 23:22, 18 December 2010 (UTC)
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:[[:Category:Furniture]] is a pretty bad offender too. [[User:Rehevkor|Rehevkor]] <big>[[User talk:Rehevkor|<FONT COLOR="black">✉</FONT>]]</big> 23:30, 18 December 2010 (UTC)
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:I'm not so sure about this. If I search for "dibbler" or "dibbler clones" then the category obviously doesn't show up in search without someone creating a redirect for it. (Redirect to specific clone within the clones page might be ugly or bad usability?) But I think there should be a page for Dibbler himself, which includes a link to dibbler clones. Meanwhile the clones page shows under category NPCs, and the pages of each of those NPCs can be grouped together that way.
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:Furniture is an example but is it good or bad? It has a redirect from the search term "furniture" which could also be a Furniture page (instead of category page) that explains furniture in general. The Furniture would probably need a link to the furniture category because individual pieces of furniture can certainly deserve their own wiki pages. In this case a few of them already have one and Category:Furniture indexes them nicely. Whatever is the final setup Furniture should probably also happen to Container(s) (which is a sibling category but not really parent or child) and its potential sub-category Scabbard(s). (Both currently pages but individual containers or scabbards could well have their own pages, especially if there's something special about them that needs explaining like involved acquisition, unique commands, room chat etc.
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:Similar discussion might also happen under [[Category_talk:Items]] since the big Items and Weapons category pages are being cleaned up right around now.
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:[[User:Pekkar|Rhonwen]] 12:37, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
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::Well the purpose of categories are to list articles currently within the wiki. The ability to add text to them is just so a brief description can be added, no information should be there that isn't already in the article space. I see no reason why this information should be listed within a category page. As for the furniture page, a good option would be to move it to [[Furniture]] and split the list itself into [[List of furniture]], or similar. These articles can all be categorised/subcategorised as required but the infornation should be in the article space. [[User:Rehevkor|Rehevkor]] <big>[[User talk:Rehevkor|<FONT COLOR="black">✉</FONT>]]</big> 15:15, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
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:::Hmmm.  Well, I guess since it's messing up searching, it ''would'' be better to split them.  It's just a bit annoying to me to have what's basically one thing split up into several pages (I mean, the category itself is a bit of an afterthought... for most furniture, I see no reason whatsoever they should have separate pages--since all the relevant information about them is in the list (in a superior format, imo, since you can easily compare it with others that way), it's just very redundant and basically extra work to make... clutter) so that you have to hunt around and wikiwalk to find something.  But meh.
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:::Maybe it would be best to just have [[:Category:Furniture]], [[Furniture]] and [[List of storage furniture]] (since that one list is really the thing making that page huge).
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:::--[[User:Ilde|Ilde]] 18:40, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
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::::I guess Category-articles started off with a need to have the category pages be more useful, to combine purposes to make them more complete, especially when the content is (initially anyway) rather small. Or maybe you want to include all the member pages which you can do for free in the category page, sort of like a See also section that updates itself when anticipated new pages come in (which may not actually show up).
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::::I suppose the list of member pages can be seen as adding little to the page, especially when they are also integrated in the text or tables... But if you do want to include them I don't think you can otherwise without adding a module. It's possible to include a normal page inside a category, but then if it's not just parts of it it's just a duplicate page without the list of member pages.
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::::For the technical search issue it should be possible to add the Category namespace (or any other namespace) to the [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:$wgNamespacesToBeSearchedDefault default search of anonymous users and users who have not changed it in preferences]. There's also many other namespaces in this wiki that are not searched by default: "Discworld MUD Wiki", talk pages, user pages, template pages, Research...
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::::So beyond the search issue which looks fixable, is it better to have category-articles with list of member pages or is this wholly undesirable or what's the criteria that makes it bad/ok?
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::::--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 08:36, 22 December 2010 (UTC)
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:::::Hrmmmm, maybe.  I think I'm coming around to the "categories shouldn't also be articles" view a bit, though, even if the search thing isn't insurmountable.  I mean, in some instances it does clearly seem to be better to have them separate, like with [[Weapons]] and [[:Category:Weapons]], because the pages are ''for'' fairly different things.  I was going to hold up [[:Category:Contractor npcs]] as one where it does seem to work better for the information to be in the category, but actually I think that can be moved to [[Real estate decoration]], where it will fit better.  It might be neater to do them all consistently, instead of only separating them out when one or both aspects are really large... also, I guess if you click on a category from a page ''in'' the category, it's probably in order to see what pages there are that are similar, so the bit you'd be looking for is the category bit, and it's nice to have it right there rather than at the very bottom after a bunch of other stuff you need to scroll past.
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:::::One that's caught my attention is [[:Category:Finding_and_seeking]].  Well, I like the table, and it's not as big as [[:Category:Furniture]] was, but it seems a bit... I don't know.  Like it ''would'' be better to have the table on a separate page.  And maybe rename it all, too--the current name is more than a little unintuitive (I remember the search for a title that actually encompassed all the things in the category...).  Maybe [[Scrying and tracking methods]]?  /tangent
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:::::And of course the aforementioned [[:Category:Dibbler clones]] is pretty similar.  They've both got the useful tables of everything/everyone that is (or should be) in that category and in both cases separating it out would pretty much just involve cutting a chunk out of the article, moving it to a similarly-named page, and cross-linking.  There does seem to be something weird about having a list of pages in a category, and then, underneath it, having the "Pages in category" thing that every category has.
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:::::--[[User:Ilde|Ilde]] 06:35, 25 December 2010 (UTC)
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::::::Ok that makes sense. I'll leave [[:Category:Finding_and_seeking]] for you to do. Maybe just [[Seeking methods]]? Since there's no seek command and seeking can mean seeing from afar it's a bit more generic that find.
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::::::--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 03:52, 26 December 2010 (UTC)
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:::::::I don't know, [[Seeking methods]] as a name has the same problem with being sort of awkward and unintuitive, I think.  While track ''is'' a command, in context I think it'd be clear that the category's broader than just that command (and the article titles wouldn't be similar enough that linking to the wrong one would be likely to be a problem)... and "ways to track someone" seems like a natural way to describe track, Find, Find Corpse, or flying to someone (actual scrying stuff, too, but there's an extra level there in that you have to recognize the room... a less direct (even if potentially more informative) way to find someone.  I do think they're alike enough that they should all be in one category as they are currently, though).
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:::::::Also, eh, some of the things in there--[[A Cup of Tea and Sake]], [[Far Sight]], [[Worstler's Advanced Metallurgical Glance]] and [[Worstler's Elementary Mineralogical Glance]] aren't really about finding people/things ''as such'', but they are definitely scrying.
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:::::::--[[User:Ilde|Ilde]] 06:01, 26 December 2010 (UTC)
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::::::::I don't think the name needs to be exactly what everyone will type. Say they type find, they'll see the links back to the more generic page. We can add links at the top and bottom, some redirects...
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::::::::Actually, the far seeing things fit with seek because you're seeking those locations and seeking beings, corpses, etc. whereas track doesn't work so much for everything.
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::::::::--[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 06:57, 26 December 2010 (UTC)
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:::::::::Well... it's not going to be what everyone would think to call it anyway, but I think titles that are at least intuitive once you've ''seen'' them are better (I know there are pages I've made with sort of wonky titles, but it's because I couldn't think of anything better :( ).  I mean, we have [[:Category:Light sources]], not [[:Category:Things with brightness]].  And it should be pretty clear what a page/category is about from the title, which I'm not sure is true for it currently.
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:::::::::Not everything fits under tracking, no, but the others fit under scrying.
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:::::::::--[[User:Ilde|Ilde]] 18:23, 26 December 2010 (UTC)
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::::::::::Ok I vote just [[Seeking]] them. Simple and to the point and the definition in [http://www.thefreedictionary.com/seeking the free dictionary] fits all. If a better name is found it can be moved. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 21:33, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
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== Upcoming events ==
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3 May 2011 Xola (Talk | contribs) (6,652 bytes) (n.b. prev edit doesn't mean I'm comin, people remaining=diffrent type of ppl frm whn I was @school, met few cool ppl alrdy. the culture of cres attractd OCD & PK obnoxiousness rathr thn creativity...)
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3 May 2011 Xola (Talk | contribs) (6,651 bytes) (+ current/soon/previous events ( Category:Events ))
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3 May 2011 Chat (Rolling back. Not worthy of being at the top of the main page, and clashes against the existing main page layout. Use the 'people of discworld' box if you really think this is necessary.)
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15 May 2011 Xola (Oh come on,"not worthy"? :) Boxes too cluttered,current &upcoming stuff is *really* important, if more people knew was a place to put stuff up,would encourage more things being organised!)
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15 May 2011 Frazyl (Considering there has not been any upcoming events, it seems better to put it in "People of Discworld". Now we could put it in the navigation sidebar but I'm not sure if the category is the best page.)
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Stop thinking like librarians! :)
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http://community-roundtable.com/2011/04/the-fallacy-of-the-organic-community/
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Build it and they will come! Don't base it around what's there, make it an open environment for people to add and start new things, and it will happen! Probably!
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Though I don't know why I'm doing it because none of the events are even vaguely social anymore just grindy stuff or related to minigames so pff, just nostalgia of what the place used to be I guess hehe
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--[[User:Xola|Xola]] 09:57, 21 May 2011 (UTC)
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:No need to give it such prominence on the main page, there's already an events link in one of the boxes below. And there's no need to dick around with the formatting of the main page, it's fine how it is. I don't really wanna have to protect it. There's a whole wiki out there for you to create whatever articles you want. [[User:Rehevkor|Rehevkor]] <big>[[User talk:Rehevkor|<FONT COLOR="black">✉</FONT>]]</big> 14:19, 21 May 2011 (UTC)
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:And not long after I reverted the main page I put a link to [[Events]] in the navigation bar (to the left just below the turtle). So for a while now that link is present in ALL pages. Surely that's present enough? I suppose I could make it a different colour.
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:Now granted the page looks a bit messy right now, I think it would be best to turn it into a table but I haven't had the time yet. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 19:00, 21 May 2011 (UTC)
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::Ok I put the Events link with a yellow background. Should stand out enough. You'll have to force refresh (not just refresh) the page to see it, or clear the cache of your browser. Or you can restart it. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 19:20, 21 May 2011 (UTC)
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::I changed the [[Events]] page into a table, I think it looks usable. Just need people to add upcoming events or even past events to the table. I added some past events but getting dates for when it happened wasn't always easy. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 20:48, 21 May 2011 (UTC)
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:::The yellow link stands out even worse than the original overly-prominent link on the main page.  Sorry, but I really don't think that's warranted - [[events]] is not '''the most important page in this wiki'''.  Really it isn't.  And punting it right up to the top of the main page, or putting it in an extra-special stand-out colour gives that impression.
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:::Xole, there's a new events command in-mud (see [http://discworld.atuin.net/lpc/blog/blog.c?action=filter&blog=recent%20developments&id=379 here]) which ought to cater to your needs.  If you have events to advertise, that's the command to use.  The wiki really isn't suited to being an announcement medium, nor is it intended to be. --[[User:Chat|Chat]] 21:12, 21 May 2011 (UTC)
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::::Yes, I suppose the yellow background stood out a bit too much. I checked the events command on the mud the other day and all there was on it was the AM council election. People mostly just post events to the boards. --[[User:Frazyl|Frazyl]] 22:40, 21 May 2011 (UTC)
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::::Agree, the yellow isn't really necessary. [[User:Rehevkor|Rehevkor]] <big>[[User talk:Rehevkor|<FONT COLOR="black">✉</FONT>]]</big> 23:10, 21 May 2011 (UTC)
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Latest revision as of 12:52, 20 September 2020

Filing cabinet.gif Old content for this page has been archived, and can be found at the following locations.
Main Page/Archive 1Main Page/Archive 2Main Page/Archive 3
Main Page/Archive 4Main Page/Archive 5Main Page/Archive 6

Important message, outages, announcements, etc

If the mud is down or you need to announce some big thing happening or there's a bug that does something super bad or similar please:

  1. Go copy a message you like from Editing Sitenotice
  2. Go to MediaWiki:Sitenotice and paste and edit the message for this specific use. Save.
  3. Go to MediaWiki:Sitenotice id and increase the number by 1. Save.

This can only be done by users with the editinterface permission. These users have access.

After the notice has served its use:

  1. Go to MediaWiki:Sitenotice and clear everything so it doesn't leave a ghost dismiss link.
  2. (Optional) Copy your super cool new message that might be reused in Editing Sitenotice.


If you cannot modify that page, then edit Sitenotice with the message you would like to be displayer on all wiki pages.

  • This is not currently going to update the banner. This will have to be done manually. But it should be noticed and someone will (probably) modify MediaWiki:Sitenotice or offer feedback.


See also the Status page for a place to discuss issues.

--Frazyl (talk) 12:50, 20 September 2020 (EDT)

Alternative login: disctemp.starturtle.net port 23 or 4242

Note for 18 Sep 2020 by QingFeng: The usual path to the MUD discworld.starturtle.net port 4242 is down! There is an alternative path to the mud: disctemp.starturtle.net port 23 or 4242. This is not a temporary copy of the MUD, it is another path to the actual MUD.

(One) Wodan wisps: and this is NOT a temp mud, but the real thing, in case anyone wasn't clear on that yet

Adding users to the wiki

Administrators for this wiki can create new accounts if anyone playing on the mud wants one. The only criteria right now is that they must have an account on Discworld mud. The account name should match one of their mud account name or be a recognizable variation of it. Accounts of past players are kept to know who modified what even if they are deleted from the mud.

Players should contact through the mud someone from this list who has been active on the mud recently asking for an account to be made for them.

The procedure for wiki administrators is:

  1. Go to Special:CreateAccount, when logged in.
  2. With email
    1. Enter a username and an email address, and click the "by email" button.
    2. The account will be created with a random password which is then emailed to the given address (as with the "forgot password" feature). The user will be requested to change password at first login; when they do, their e-mail address will also be marked as confirmed.
  3. Without email
    1. Without an email the administrator enters the requested password or makes a random one.
    2. They then send the password to the user by mudmail telling them to login and change their password to something else.
  4. If anything fails, post a message to User_talk:Frazyl or send a mudmail to Frazyl.

--Frazyl (talk) 02:08, 23 December 2016 (EST)

Clubs pages

Also asked by Emily for other mudders is to have pages for clubs. This is fine, you can create pages for your club as a subpage like Club/Charm Chasers.

The club pages will be listed automagically in the Club page.

--Frazyl (talk) 16:39, 9 November 2018 (EST)

Todo

  • Update to latest MediaWiki.
  • Move quests to individual pages in quests namespace (to prevent showing up in default search) with warning at the beginning and include them all in existing pages. This makes it easier to read the whole quest if you want to or to edit it, it still shows the pages with hidden text like now for those who prefer that, and it allows linking quests in several lists.
  • Think of a way to allow people to create accounts themselves by checking that they have accounts on the mud, copy/pasting something from the mud or something like that.
  • Document everything on the mud. research

--Frazyl (talk) 02:08, 23 December 2016 (EST)

TM wiki gone

As Aphaea noticed, the TM wiki is gone, but archive.org still has several snapshots, this is the latest one. Aphaea has started copying data across, I was just wondering: Would it be better to have the TM stuff on the skills' research pages? --Gunde 16:05, 28 March 2013 (UTC)

I think it's fine either way. I'd prefer if all the bonus ranges were on the same page because it means less clicking. The way Aphaea is doing seems fine to me, especially since there's links to other skills to help navigation. --Frazyl 17:42, 28 March 2013 (UTC)


Working on creating a house format for the TMs section being added to all the skills pages.

So far removing all anomalies at the start of fields and capitalzing them however I will be aiming to have the 'action taken' field in a set format rather than it is now, before i work out how this will be i would like peoples input (If this page is still used --Ascdren 13:27 30 march 2013 (UTC)

Archiving

To archive the Main Page:

  • Create a new archive page called 'Talk:Main Page/Archive X', where X is the number after the last archive page listed on top of this page.
  • Move any sections which have been solved or that are old and not useful anymore to this new page.
  • Put the {{talkarchive}} template at the top of the archive page.
  • Update the {{archives}} template (increase numarchives by one) at the top of this page.

--Frazyl (talk) 02:08, 23 December 2016 (EST)